YOU have my blessings! now will you go get that attorney before something else is said!
Someone has to leave, who is it going to be?
So when is the divorce party in 90 days? see you on another site.
Sarah Smiles
JoinedPosts by Sarah Smiles
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I finally said it...It's time for us to get divorce
by kzjw ini asked my wife over the weekend for a divorce...1st let me say that this sight gives support for those affected by the borg - ex-jw's, ubm's etc...but it also consumes some of us.
of this i am guilty.
i have developed such a disdain for the wtbs that i can no longer have a conversation with my wife without attacking her religion.
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How many study ed WT used the phrase...
by kzjw in"god's sole channel of communication" and "if jehovah is our father, then org is the mother" or similar?
my wife now says she' never read that in a wt, so i need ashort list from this year's editions for proof.
any takers?.
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Sarah Smiles
It is in the Revelation Its Grand Climax Is At Hand! Look It Up! I no longer have this book! and that should be good enough reason to walk away!
1 And a great sign was seen in heaven, a woman arrayed with the sun, and the moon was beneath her feet, and on her head was a crown of twelve stars, 2 and she was pregnant. And she cries out in her pains and in her agony to give birth.
3 And another sign was seen in heaven, and, look! a great fiery-colored dragon, with seven heads and ten horns and upon its heads seven diadems; 4 and its tail drags a third of the stars of heaven, and it hurled them down to the earth. And the dragon kept standing before the woman who was about to give birth, that, when she did give birth, it might devour her child.
THE ORGANIZATION!
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Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 11-23-08 WT Study (MARRIAGE)
by blondie inquote.
quote.
quote.
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Sarah Smiles
Q 3. Some Jews developed what mistaken view?
3. In the centuries since, Satan has used a variety of sly methods to spread marital discord. For instance, at times he has used religious leaders to promote an unscriptural view of marriage. Some Jewish leaders minimized God's standards, allowing husbands to divorce their wives for such trivial matters as over-salting food. But Jesus pointed out: "Whoever divorces his wife. except on the ground of fornication, and marries another commits adultery."-Matt. 19:9.Who said anything about husband it was a man
“Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife on every sort of ground?”Just like Joseph who was not married to Mary who wanted to divorce her!
I do not see JW apply a pre marital doctrine! What about someone who break off an engagement for no reason! OH well LOL! Not that I really care!
This is just applied WRONG!
(Eccl. 4:12) "Threefold cord" is a figurative expression. When this illustration is applied to marriage it includes the husband and wife, the first two strands, who are intertwined with the central strand, Jehovah God. Being united with God gives a couple the spiritual strength to cope with problems, and it is the key to achieving the greatest happiness in marriage
This reminds me of Rutherford’s writings! Threefold cord is a type of marriage with God as the third partner! LOL It sound good to try to apply with God and marriage but it is an abuse of God’s scriptures! Let just apply hard times for the oppressive to a marriage union! WTBTS when will YOU ever learn!
Q 8. What is needed to receive "a good reward" in marriage?
Wise King Solomon wrote: "Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their hard work." (Eccl. 4:9) Indeed, a husband and wife must work hard in order to obtain "A good reward" in the form of a loving and lasting union that has God's blessing.
New World Translation!Eccls 4: 6-11
6 Better is a handful of rest than a double handful of hard work and striving after the wind. 7 I myself returned that I might see the vanity under the sun: 8 There exists one, but not a second one; also no son or brother does he have, but there is no end to all his hard work. Also, his eyes themselves are not satisfied with riches: “And for whom am I working hard and causing my soul to lack in good things?” This too is vanity, and it is a calamitous occupation. 9 Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their hard work. 10 For if one of them should fall, the other one can raise his partner up. But how will it be with just the one who falls when there is not another to raise him up?
11 Moreover, if two lie down together, they also will certainly get warm; but how can just one keep warm? 12 And if somebody could overpower one alone, two together could make a stand against him. And a threefold cord cannot quickly be torn in two.
I busted a gut on this one! Not too sure what it means! What is the threefold! It sounds like men working close net! Two can stand against an invader but three cannot be torn in two!
So I had to go look it up!
Gateway with another bible Here It Is!
New International Bible
Ecclesiastes 4
1 Again I looked and saw all the oppression that was taking place under the sun: (has nothing to do with marriage)
I saw the tears of the oppressed—
and they have no comforter;
power was on the side of their oppressors—
and they have no comforter.7 Again I saw something meaningless under the sun:
8 There was a man all alone;
he had neither son nor brother.
There was no end to his toil,
yet his eyes were not content with his wealth.
"For whom am I toiling," he asked,
"and why am I depriving myself of enjoyment?"
This too is meaningless—
a miserable business!9 Two are better than one,
because they have a good return for their work:10 If one falls down,
his friend can help him up.
But pity the man who falls
and has no one to help him up!11 Also, if two lie down together, they will keep warm.
But how can one keep warm alone?12 Though one may be overpowered,
two can defend themselves.
A cord of three strands is not quickly broken.Typical WTBTS they don’t even read the entire scriptures! It sounds like oppressive people who could do better if they slept close to keep warm and watch out! Perhap it would be better to have friends lie together during stressful times! One is down and two can defend themselves! Might be three friends one down and two to fight, who knows! I am sure during war times many lie together for warmth even if they are rich! why should this man be alone!
Marriage has nothing to do with it! So there threefold and marriage doctrine does not stand and the entire WT article falls! It just makes me mad when they do this!
Thanks Blondie for the meeting! and that is the reason why I do not read the WT!
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United Brotherhood - even in the reverse...?
by johnnyc inits a bit odd to me to finally understand what "united brotherhood" means from this web site.
even though i traveled for work, i was not the guy to make sure to go to every meeting abroad.
in fact, i didn't even once go to another "branch" office.
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Sarah Smiles
I was only told from my local congregation that what I would experience here (locally) would be the same sort of thing (they said love) experienced globally at any Kingdom Hall.
IF that is what THEY call LOVE! by lying: Through out my reinstatement which took years and even when I became reinstated (Marked) most of the elders lied! Lying is not love it is from Satan! They made promises and did not keep them!
So yes you will get the same thing at all the Kingdom Halls! Elders sharing information with other elders about your personal elders meetings. When it is none of their business!
AND you will read a lot of that on this site! Ch_ck M_rtini is one of them, he can't keep his mouth shut, he shares with wife and wife shares with other elders wives. Later, he tells me about it with I just wanted to help you! Last elder I trusted! LOL
In fact I think we should make a list of un-trust worthy elders for newly DF people.
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Every JW should be asked...
by Honesty inthe following 2 questions when they arrive at your door with the watchtower society's 'good news' and their jesus (the prehuman angel michael, the human jesus and a resurrected spirit creature [6/15/06 watchtower page 30]) who is 3 persons in one:.
the first question is, if you truly abstain from blood, how can you belong to a religion that allows parts of blood?.
the second question is, would you donate blood so that the fractions allowed by the watchtower society could save the life of one of your jehovah's witness brothers or sisters?.
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Sarah Smiles
Hey that is a really good question! can they donate blood?
LOL
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Which "Michael" in Daniel? Really need a little help here
by kzjw inthis refers to the on-going michael the archangel is jesus argument.... my wife gives daniel 10:13, 21 and 12:1 as proof that michael is the post-ressurected jesus.
are those versus even referring to michael the archangel or some other michael?
if so, where is the proof that it refers to him as jesus?
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Sarah Smiles
Supposedly Jesus had the keys, right? And this fifth angel (Rev. 9) comes with a key to open the pit.
Yes, that is why the WTBTS believes that Michael is Jesus! but I think Jesus was given higher authority than any archangel! Happy reading!
Revelation 1:12
12 And I turned to see the voice that was speaking with me, and, having turned, I saw seven golden lampstands, 13 and in the midst of the lampstands someone like a son of man, clothed with a garment that reached down to the feet, and girded at the breasts with a golden girdle. 14 Moreover, his head and his hair were white as white wool, as snow, and his eyes as a fiery flame; 15 and his feet were like fine copper when glowing in a furnace; and his voice was as the sound of many waters. 16 And he had in his right hand seven stars, and out of his mouth a sharp, long two-edged sword was protruding, and his countenance was as the sun when it shines in its power. 17 And when I saw him, I fell as dead at his feet.
And he laid his right hand upon me and said: “Do not be fearful. I am the First and the Last, 18 and the living one; and I became dead, but, look! I am living forever and ever, and I have the keys of death and of Ha´des.
NOTE: Yes ,Jesus had the keys more than one and could give those keys to anyone he wants! So it makes since that when he received the scrolls in chapter 5 that as scrolls were open, angels did what they asked ! Chapter 5 “Who is worthy to open the scroll and loose its seals?”12 saying with a loud voice: “The Lamb that was slaughtered is worthy to receive the power and riches and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and blessing.”
After chapter 5 there are a lot of angels doing there thing some with trumpet and other stating the WOE!
Revelation 11:
Note: Revelation 12 is a third WOE! See scriptures! Now Revelation 12:7 no longer makes sense to group it with the sayings in Heavens! Does it make sense that Revelation 11:7 is Jesus in 10 Notice 7 is a seen with Michael 10 is sayings after Michael‘s war! So leave the saying out! Verse 10! And I heard a loud voice in heaven say: “Now have come to pass the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ, because the accuser of our brothers has been hurled down, who accuses them day and night before our God! So the saying is explaining Jesus power which really goes with chapter 5! And Michael would not fight if it were not for the authority of his Christ! Below, I cut the scripture out so one can see the reading differently.
Revelation 12
7 And war broke out in heaven: Mi´cha·el and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and its angels battled 8 but it did not prevail, neither was a place found for them any longer in heaven. 9 So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him. 11 And they conquered him because of the blood of the Lamb and because of the word of their witnessing, and they did not love their souls even in the face of death.
Note: JW just lump 10 as an explanation of who Michael is in 7 but it does not work with the woes of Angels, trumpets of Angels, and the Bowls poored out by angels 12 On this account be glad, YOU heavens and YOU who reside in them! Woe for the earth and for the sea, because the Devil has come down to YOU, having great anger, knowing he has a short period of time.”
Revelation 8:12
12 And the fourth angel blew his trumpet. And a third of the sun was smitten and a third of the moon and a third of the stars, in order that a third of them might be darkened and the day might not have illumination for a third of it, and the night likewise.
13 And I saw, and I heard an eagle flying in midheaven say with a loud voice: “Woe, woe, woe to those dwelling on the earth because of the rest of the trumpet blasts of the three angels who are about to blow their trumpets!”
NOTE:
Revelation 9:1 Once again a star (angel) that had fallen The Key was given him! Could also mean Jesus in Chapter 5 gave a key to this star! and part of the opening of the seals! It was one key and not a group of keys like in verse 1. Not enough proof that this star is Jesus! But I do not think that Jesus had fallen like Michael kicked him out! Revelation 9:1 Can you go all the way back to Revelation 1 with Jesus who was given keys( more than one) to death and Hades and not look at Chapter 5? I think not! One needs to look at the angels chapter 5 through 9 who obey the lamb! All was done because the blood of Jesus Christ!Revelation 9:1 And the fifth angel blew his trumpet. And I saw a star that had fallen from heaven to the earth, and the key of the pit of the abysswas given him. 2 And he opened the pit of the abyss, and smoke ascended out of the pit as the smoke of a great furnace, and the sun was darkened, also the air, by the smoke of the pit.
Note:
I guess I will keep going! I suppose because Michael is the only angel named in Revelations does make him different but does it make him him Jesus? When Jesus was given an unknown name and Michael has a name? But could he be a strong angel, or mighty angel. No proof of that either! There is one scripture that express Jesus a the bright and morning star!Question: Perhaps someone else can explain the bright and morning star verses star fallen?
Revelation 14:
7And I saw another angel flying in midheaven
8 And another, a second angel, followed, saying:
9And another angel, a third, followed them, saying in a loud voice
15And another angel emerged from the temple
17And still another angel emerged from the temple
18 And still another angel emerged from the altar and he had authority over the fire
Here comes the bowls:
16:1 And I heard a loud voice out of the sanctuary say to the seven angels: “Go and pour out the seven bowls of the anger of God into the earth.”
2 And the first one(angel) etc!
And the third one poured out his bowl into the rivers and the fountains of the waters. And they became blood. 5 And I heard the angel over the waters say: “You, the One who is and who was, the loyal One, are righteous, because you have rendered these decisions,
Question: Can anyone tell me who the WTBTS says this is in the Revelation It’s Grand Climax book Can you cross reference their NWT with which Scripture they apply it with. I believe it has something to do with Daniel and a mighty or strong angel. Also, Hebrew 1 angels. Was this another change in doctrine to match mighty or strong angels?
Revelation 18:1
1 After these things I saw another angel
21 And a strong angel WTBTS say this is Jesus!
Note:
The Lamb is in authority over the scroll and all these angels are that are on his side with their bowls, trumpets, and woes and they are obeying him. -
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If you cheat on me, I will forgive you, but not if you leave Jehovah
by Hiddenwindow inwhen i told my wife that i no longer believe the wt is the truth, she started crying and said that it was easier for her to forgive me if i am unfaithful to her than if i leave the wt.
i am sure now: being a witness is a form of mental illness.
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Sarah Smiles
That is the problem with many marriages and the reason why people are not close!
You expressed your free will and trusted her enough to share your thoughs with her and she turned on you!
How could you attend a place where you do not think it is the truth!
You would think she would have said something else beside the WT?
Also, have you been unfaithful? It sound like you have been! But for her to mention it again well that’s not forgiving at all that throwing it in your face.
Do you know how hard it is for a woman to forgive unfaithfulness? It next to impossible!
Tell her you are still the same person but it is a personal choice to leave the WT!
JOHNNYC; You have more problems than Hiddenwindow! Wew, Your wife really does have problems! And a new baby in the mixture is not a good sign! Your wife's problem is something that you can not hide or think it will go away.
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Basic JW beliefs
by happy1975 ini may have an opportunity to discuss why i no longer attend meetings with an old friend that i ran into the other day.
she is very zealous - a pioneer for many years.
i've printed some newspaper articles that refer to the child abuse scandal.
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Sarah Smiles
How come the JW do not pray through Michael?
NO! just enjoy your time with her and avoid doctrine at all cost. Sometimes it is better to let people go home in peace.
But if you must!
Hebrew 1: 8 But with reference to the Son: “God is your throne forever and ever, and [the] scepter of your kingdom is the scepter of uprightness
Jehovah reference the Son as God!
I dont think any JW can get around that one becuae they are too focused on the scepter. Hmm, and I am not too sure it that is a future Jesus who stand with a scepter or Michael. Right now they claim Jesus is sitting on the right hand of his father and he has not stood up yet.
Have fun! you probably will not have coffee with her again.
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Which "Michael" in Daniel? Really need a little help here
by kzjw inthis refers to the on-going michael the archangel is jesus argument.... my wife gives daniel 10:13, 21 and 12:1 as proof that michael is the post-ressurected jesus.
are those versus even referring to michael the archangel or some other michael?
if so, where is the proof that it refers to him as jesus?
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Sarah Smiles
1Th 4:16
For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.My response has always been, if this verse makes Jesus into Michael, it also make him into a trumpet
I agree with you Deputy Dog! The voice does not make him Michael. It just like saying a singer has a voice of an angel. Does that mean the singer conveying the messages is an angel? NO!
First there's Michael to open the pit and unleash the forces of the locusts with scorpion stings
And… where did you find that information is it in the bible? If I am not mistaken Jesus the lamb opened up the scrolls and the angels perform their duties? Jesus had the right to opened the scrolls like a commander and chief and the faithfull angels did what they were told including Michael.
The WTBTS is wrong and it does not hold up. That should be enough to scare anyone away from the Jehovah’s Witness or the SDAs, or any religion for that matter.
Look even the best scholars can not say when the Jewish people applied meanings to names.
What does that tell you about the meaning of Michael, “One Who Is Like God” It's was trumped up by the Jewish people; two different scriptures skipped every other word! Who _ _ _ Is_ _ _ _ _ _ like. another scripture _ _ _ _ God_ _ _ _The scriptures does not even apply to a future Jesus it was just random! Now that is not from God!
So what are we as Christians to do! Apply a false meaning of Michael to prove this is Jesus? or study it out!
Jewish people did not even believe Jesus was the Messiah so why not make up some garbage to Michael so the Christians would think Michael is the Messiah. It is garbage and a false DOCTRINE!
There is too much evidence that goes against this doctrine. Stupid WTBTS did not think people would do their research!
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CT Russell was not the only wacky pyramidologist
by Awakened at Gilead ini just finished reading a 1943 essay by bertrand russell (not related to crackpot ctr as far as i know, lol) where he discusses his cynical viewpoint of religious beliefs.
towards the end of his essay, he indicates that, instead of being disgusted by people who believe crazy implausibilities, he is actually somewhat amused, even entertained, by some of them, when their beliefs are generally harmless to the rest of the population.
after listing a few of these what he terms superstitions that "add to the gaity of life", he makes an interesting statement that jws should pay attention to:.
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Sarah Smiles
If I remember right! there was a prize pocket of money from some university where at one time Sir Isaac Newton was president and a proud Free Mason. The school wanted people to come up with something new to the science field. People like Smyth and Russell and many more quacks wrote about the Great Pyramids. Why? because Sir Isaac Newton said God’s numbers or measurement were perfect when he gave them to Solomon to build the temple in the bible. Later, these idiots were trying to copy Newton's concept with the Great Pyramid and wrote their proposal of new light. It was just a bunch of Free Masons having some fun and combining their writings and measurements to gain their secret society number, plus make some money on the side! They all lost the pockets money because that is not what the university wanted, and know one will ever know who gain their 3 rd degree that year!